On the whole a good article. Fundamentally it agrees with something I posted recently, where I said the ethno-civic divide is ultimately a fake one in that nation states begin with ethnicities and any nationalism must include some ethnic consciousness to be real. And everyone except white majority nations functions this way. This is what the ethno-nats get right-without defending your ethno majority your nation is just an arbitrary imposition of force with no unifying identity. You have to acknowledge that English refers to a real people and there is nothing wrong with that. But what the civic nats get right is that practically and morally now you have to include integrated, culturally aligned, patriotic people of different races and backgrounds. And we have an easy distinction to allow that-which is Britishness.
The fact is that the situation for the white working class in the UK, for those who are ethnically English or Scottish or Welsh and not middle or upper class, is so bad now that ethnic nationalism even of an extreme kind seems the only logical response to how badly we are being treated. The disparities that are largely fictional or have non racism explanations when people pretend modern society is rigged against non whites are very real when we see how rigged it is against working class whites. No other group would have the mass rape of their children largely ignored, covered up, and even laughed about, and see its exposure have no impact on policy. You just have to imagine the media and political difference if it emerged that gangs of white men had been targeting black or Asian children for decades.
Nor is any other group told to celebrate their total replacement, their powerlessness, and their gradual extinction while finding themselves in danger of arrest if they oppose it. And it’s obvious in things other than the grooming gsngs as well-there are 15,000 charities, organisations, lobby groups and professional bodies specifically representing non-whites in the UK, and none of course that specifically represent the White British.
So protection of the White British, recognition of their reality as a group and that they built Britain and formed its core identity, is vital. But there are people of other backgrounds who have integrated, who contribute,and who pose none of the cultural and criminal problems that Pakistani Muslims have posed. You are absolutely right that a civic nationalism that was honest on both these things would be more effective than telling non whites they aren’t British.
"But there are people of other backgrounds who have integrated, who contribute,and who pose none of the cultural and criminal problems that Pakistani Muslims have posed."
I would welcome someone starting a conversation about the need to start differentiating between different groups of foreigners, rather than saying, as we currently do, that all must be treated according to the lowest common denominator.
The kosher-and-halal issue is a case in point. Technically both of these slaughter methods are, as far as I'm aware, pretty much identical - but Jews take their responsibility to be as cruelty-free as possible very seriously (an animal that has suffered isn't kosher), while the Muslims it seems do not. Also, Jews are far better integrated into British society. Even the black hats who keep their own culture intact largely don't bother anyone else.
So let's be honest here, banning halal has nothing to do with animal welfare, other than the fact that Muslims don't treat animals well so shutting down their slaughterhouses is probably a good thing. It's a policy designed to make Britain less attractive to Muslims. So why are we now lumping kosher into the policy when the same doesn't apply? Because people have this crazy idea that if a policy is applied to one set of people it must be applied to all, completely ignoring the fact that these two groups of people have nothing in common.
This is merely a push back on all the racist labels placed upon the mere act of White young U.K. girls being trafficked abused raped and murdered.If the perpetrators were a White gang of criminals they would be out of business in a heartbeat.So why has this continued unabated for almost 35 years with no let up no enquiry no justice for the victims? Because the entire system is corrupted to the core by the globalist agenda to destroy Western civilization in order to have mindless savages as slaves to be used and disposed of.Yes they have a solution to the Muslim problem as well and its biological in nature.
Restore Britain are making mistake after mistake all because they are failing to follow two old army sayings - "Time spent in preparation/recce is seldom wasted" and "Piss poor planning makes for a piss poor performance."
Finally to quote the chorus of the 60's song 'Where have all the followers gone'
"When will they ever learn, when will they ever.......learn"
More seriously British and Britons has always been a political civic term, and never has been an ethnicity. The First Nations ethnicities in the British Isles are Celts, AngloSaxons, Old Norse and Norman French; plus possibly Huguenots.
There’s none so blind… A quote for you on this book. 'A remarkable amount of light is shed upon current and coming events by this new study of that elusive thing, the nation... A lavishly researched and illustrated narrative.' By some chap named J. Enoch Powell in the Spectator.
It’s going to be left progressive pish which seeks to justify its own priors as is virtually everything out of academia these days. Without a pre political “we” you have profoundly unstable system which will fracture along identitarian lines as per Gorton and Denton. Group identity is not theory. It is self defined and white British have resisted and rejected mass immigration for decades, most pointedly in relation to immigrants from the poorest and most alien of places - who themselves largely set up in ethnic enclaves and roundly ignore the kumbaya nonsense from weak people
Not wholly unseriously either. That religion has proven itself to be incompatible with keeping the peace among the population at large, and has made some other populations downright unsafe. So why not make it unwelcome?
Unsafe ? How about taking you dog for a walk and getting stabbed to death at the age of 68 in the U.S. from uncontrolled immigration exactly what's happening all across the E.U
Reason the powers that be want a civil war to decimate the populations due to race and idealogies but they will not succeed haven't yet in thousands of years.The Calliphate was defeated and will be again but this time there will be no corpse scattered to the winds as JFK once famously said about the CIA a creation of the Rothschilds.😡🤬
I agree. Lumping kosher in doesn’t make any sense to me. Plus nobody has ever been forced to take kosher food against their choice as I don’t think we have ever had supermarkets and schools switch to it without saying anything.
"removing the rights of foreign born people to vote" Even that has its problems. What about children of British service personnel who were born abroad while the parents were serving oversees? The whole debate is difficult but we must do something.
Meanwhile, the right-wing parties are just in a self-destructing spiral. As Dr North writes, in 2029 we are likely to see a Green/Labour coalition, but 2029 is a looong way away, in political terms.
Why should I have had a vote from day 1# in the UK as a work permit holder’s dependent wife? I voted for 18 years on a foreign passport. There was no incentive to become a British national, especially once I got ILR.
I lived in the USA, for a while, on a Visa, had to pay local and national taxes but had no vote. I understood that rule, but felt that maybe I should have been able to vote for the local government as that affected my wallet directly.
My brothers were born in BMH Hanover, at the time HMG designated British Service Hospitals overseas as sovereign British territory for citizenship purposes.
Britain in 1997 or 1977 may have been homogenous but it was the sameness of a people asleep. Its culture was of the ‘tolerant, accessible, inclusive and diverse’ variety: light, fun, vain, etc. Was any of it obligatory or dogmatic? If no, it wasn’t true culture, from a worldwide view.
There’s a meme about 3rd worlders ‘milling’ about. This is a misconception. They are not doing nothing—they are active, doing a full day’s Being, in the space. If you asked them if they are doing anything, they’d say ‘yes, I am being here.’ Milling is ethnic, religious, political action. When people talk about the ethnic natives having a right to the country, this is what they mean—and we are (I am) disgusted that anyone can be so base as to think that this is adequate, or any sort of argument.
But to return to the first point, our consoomer, irreligious culture hardly improves matters.
Again, a good and sensible post! I've nothing more to add apart from, I found this discussion of English/British identity last year, on Substack, and found it generally coherent. I post the link here in case anyone wants a read, or to critique it.
On the whole a good article. Fundamentally it agrees with something I posted recently, where I said the ethno-civic divide is ultimately a fake one in that nation states begin with ethnicities and any nationalism must include some ethnic consciousness to be real. And everyone except white majority nations functions this way. This is what the ethno-nats get right-without defending your ethno majority your nation is just an arbitrary imposition of force with no unifying identity. You have to acknowledge that English refers to a real people and there is nothing wrong with that. But what the civic nats get right is that practically and morally now you have to include integrated, culturally aligned, patriotic people of different races and backgrounds. And we have an easy distinction to allow that-which is Britishness.
The fact is that the situation for the white working class in the UK, for those who are ethnically English or Scottish or Welsh and not middle or upper class, is so bad now that ethnic nationalism even of an extreme kind seems the only logical response to how badly we are being treated. The disparities that are largely fictional or have non racism explanations when people pretend modern society is rigged against non whites are very real when we see how rigged it is against working class whites. No other group would have the mass rape of their children largely ignored, covered up, and even laughed about, and see its exposure have no impact on policy. You just have to imagine the media and political difference if it emerged that gangs of white men had been targeting black or Asian children for decades.
Nor is any other group told to celebrate their total replacement, their powerlessness, and their gradual extinction while finding themselves in danger of arrest if they oppose it. And it’s obvious in things other than the grooming gsngs as well-there are 15,000 charities, organisations, lobby groups and professional bodies specifically representing non-whites in the UK, and none of course that specifically represent the White British.
So protection of the White British, recognition of their reality as a group and that they built Britain and formed its core identity, is vital. But there are people of other backgrounds who have integrated, who contribute,and who pose none of the cultural and criminal problems that Pakistani Muslims have posed. You are absolutely right that a civic nationalism that was honest on both these things would be more effective than telling non whites they aren’t British.
"But there are people of other backgrounds who have integrated, who contribute,and who pose none of the cultural and criminal problems that Pakistani Muslims have posed."
I would welcome someone starting a conversation about the need to start differentiating between different groups of foreigners, rather than saying, as we currently do, that all must be treated according to the lowest common denominator.
The kosher-and-halal issue is a case in point. Technically both of these slaughter methods are, as far as I'm aware, pretty much identical - but Jews take their responsibility to be as cruelty-free as possible very seriously (an animal that has suffered isn't kosher), while the Muslims it seems do not. Also, Jews are far better integrated into British society. Even the black hats who keep their own culture intact largely don't bother anyone else.
So let's be honest here, banning halal has nothing to do with animal welfare, other than the fact that Muslims don't treat animals well so shutting down their slaughterhouses is probably a good thing. It's a policy designed to make Britain less attractive to Muslims. So why are we now lumping kosher into the policy when the same doesn't apply? Because people have this crazy idea that if a policy is applied to one set of people it must be applied to all, completely ignoring the fact that these two groups of people have nothing in common.
This is merely a push back on all the racist labels placed upon the mere act of White young U.K. girls being trafficked abused raped and murdered.If the perpetrators were a White gang of criminals they would be out of business in a heartbeat.So why has this continued unabated for almost 35 years with no let up no enquiry no justice for the victims? Because the entire system is corrupted to the core by the globalist agenda to destroy Western civilization in order to have mindless savages as slaves to be used and disposed of.Yes they have a solution to the Muslim problem as well and its biological in nature.
Restore Britain are making mistake after mistake all because they are failing to follow two old army sayings - "Time spent in preparation/recce is seldom wasted" and "Piss poor planning makes for a piss poor performance."
Finally to quote the chorus of the 60's song 'Where have all the followers gone'
"When will they ever learn, when will they ever.......learn"
More seriously British and Britons has always been a political civic term, and never has been an ethnicity. The First Nations ethnicities in the British Isles are Celts, AngloSaxons, Old Norse and Norman French; plus possibly Huguenots.
There’s none so blind… A quote for you on this book. 'A remarkable amount of light is shed upon current and coming events by this new study of that elusive thing, the nation... A lavishly researched and illustrated narrative.' By some chap named J. Enoch Powell in the Spectator.
He was a good man and British elites ought to have responded to the existential threat he outlined
Post modern nonsense
Read a book, as the young folk say, specifically this one:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Britons-Forging-1707-1837-Linda-Colley/dp/0300152809/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1392726509&sr=1-1&keywords=Britons%3A+Forging+the+Nation+1707-1837
Oh, and I don’t think you understand what post modern means…
It’s going to be left progressive pish which seeks to justify its own priors as is virtually everything out of academia these days. Without a pre political “we” you have profoundly unstable system which will fracture along identitarian lines as per Gorton and Denton. Group identity is not theory. It is self defined and white British have resisted and rejected mass immigration for decades, most pointedly in relation to immigrants from the poorest and most alien of places - who themselves largely set up in ethnic enclaves and roundly ignore the kumbaya nonsense from weak people
Not wholly seriously, 90% of the UKs problems would disappear if you banned Islam (Hat tip to the Saudis)…
Not wholly unseriously either. That religion has proven itself to be incompatible with keeping the peace among the population at large, and has made some other populations downright unsafe. So why not make it unwelcome?
Unsafe ? How about taking you dog for a walk and getting stabbed to death at the age of 68 in the U.S. from uncontrolled immigration exactly what's happening all across the E.U
countries but nowhere else I wonder why?
Islam runs the UK show in case you hadn’t noticed. They ain’t getting banned.
Reason the powers that be want a civil war to decimate the populations due to race and idealogies but they will not succeed haven't yet in thousands of years.The Calliphate was defeated and will be again but this time there will be no corpse scattered to the winds as JFK once famously said about the CIA a creation of the Rothschilds.😡🤬
Whooosh!
I agree. Lumping kosher in doesn’t make any sense to me. Plus nobody has ever been forced to take kosher food against their choice as I don’t think we have ever had supermarkets and schools switch to it without saying anything.
Perhaps because Jews are not trying to take over?
Yes. Very much so.
"removing the rights of foreign born people to vote" Even that has its problems. What about children of British service personnel who were born abroad while the parents were serving oversees? The whole debate is difficult but we must do something.
Meanwhile, the right-wing parties are just in a self-destructing spiral. As Dr North writes, in 2029 we are likely to see a Green/Labour coalition, but 2029 is a looong way away, in political terms.
Why should I have had a vote from day 1# in the UK as a work permit holder’s dependent wife? I voted for 18 years on a foreign passport. There was no incentive to become a British national, especially once I got ILR.
I lived in the USA, for a while, on a Visa, had to pay local and national taxes but had no vote. I understood that rule, but felt that maybe I should have been able to vote for the local government as that affected my wallet directly.
My brothers were born in BMH Hanover, at the time HMG designated British Service Hospitals overseas as sovereign British territory for citizenship purposes.
You go to a country to live, you take on its fundamental values.
In our country, Christian/human fundamental values, parity in legal matters, recognition that you must contribute financially to obtain benefit
from that country.
That makes you a citizen 2nd class, to be a citizen 1st class you your parents or your close family must have sacrificed for your country.
Many countries around the world have rules that are recognised as humane and fair on the ethnic populace.
Look around.
👏👏👏👏
Britain in 1997 or 1977 may have been homogenous but it was the sameness of a people asleep. Its culture was of the ‘tolerant, accessible, inclusive and diverse’ variety: light, fun, vain, etc. Was any of it obligatory or dogmatic? If no, it wasn’t true culture, from a worldwide view.
There’s a meme about 3rd worlders ‘milling’ about. This is a misconception. They are not doing nothing—they are active, doing a full day’s Being, in the space. If you asked them if they are doing anything, they’d say ‘yes, I am being here.’ Milling is ethnic, religious, political action. When people talk about the ethnic natives having a right to the country, this is what they mean—and we are (I am) disgusted that anyone can be so base as to think that this is adequate, or any sort of argument.
But to return to the first point, our consoomer, irreligious culture hardly improves matters.
Again, a good and sensible post! I've nothing more to add apart from, I found this discussion of English/British identity last year, on Substack, and found it generally coherent. I post the link here in case anyone wants a read, or to critique it.
https://www.pimlicojournal.co.uk/p/defining-britishness?utm_source=%2Finbox%2Fsaved&utm_medium=reader2
Please delete, if you don't want it.
Should anyone who has lost the right to vote pay tax?
Why not? If I worked in Germany I would pay German taxes.